Ashen Foundry

What's wrong with AoC? How can it improve?

This is a simple little forum I have been really wanting to put together simply because progress shouldn't go unchecked. I love AoC much as the next on this site but sometimes we should address the problems it has. This isn't for things we know are going to improve like combat, or balancing but instead for the things we have seen that may diverge into other areas of or disliking. 

A quick example would be how in ESO for a long time it was a problem with the amount of effects being rendered on screen in large PVP and PVE trials encounters. In AoC so far we have seen a wide variety of effects being displayed. The tank raising walls, and the rangers current iteration of the arrow storm ability, even the basic attacks had a visual effect for every time the enemy was struck with the staff. These are some I could see being toned backwards. 

In the most recent developer play though of the game we saw them attempt a boss fight in the Dünir dungeon. I couldn't tell if the boss had any mechanics or not due to the amount of  effects being thrown out. 

With the hopes high for massive scale battles I am afraid of the amount of on screen rendering for all the class effects. Beautiful but dangerously hindering.

That's my first throw out on what they might be able to improve upon before it get's worse. Again this is constructive criticism for the game on things we might be able to catch early. No hard feelings, just want to see it be the best it can be.

About Taleteller:

Partaker in the glorious Gray Sentinals Community!

7 Replies
  1. #1

    Atropos

    Administrator148 Posts

    Hey @Taleteller, great topic. I definitely agree with you about the importance of not going full throttle on the fan train at the expense of holding the developers accountable to produce a great product. I think my biggest two concerns right now about the development of the game are:

    Avoiding Committing to Too Much

    Intrepid signed up for a lot of little things during the Kickstarter (like the Stock Market). Furthermore, even since KS, Intrepid have made little promises for different cosmetic items or features that they will throw in as a shout out to fans. These all sound nice, but if there are any production delays they are going to be stuck between keeping their word on the features they have promised to add and investing the time required into the really core game systems in order to deliver a polished and complete fundamental product.

    Strength of Networking Code and Client Scaling

    We know that Unreal 4 is a beautiful engine, and we know that for a single player or small multiplayer game its graphical fidelity will outshine almost all competition. What we don't know is how effectively it can network to support hundreds of players in a single area while still sustaining reasonable fidelity in its effects and physics. Intrepid has done a great job of bootstrapping a very pretty and playable game quickly using this engine, some out of the box assets, and some very talented in-house artists. We have not yet seen evidence that the underlying networking and scaling side of the game can keep pace. 

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying these 2 areas will cause Ashes to be bad or to fail, but as I currently weigh my own hopes and expectations for the game against some realistic concerns these are my top two that I think they will have to surmount in order to meet the high expectations that their fan community is beginning to establish for the game.

    Creator of Ashen Foundry and Tamriel Foundry. Former guildmaster of Entropy Rising. Economist and MMO enthusiast.

  2. #2

    Nybling

    Contributor19 Posts

    @Atropos 

    Your comments about the engine are probably the big thing, I think.  What makes MMOs shine is accessibility and performance on top of their gameplay.  If the engine has problems during large-scale encounters or there's just so much detail that it causes peoples computers to chug, that will cause the game a lot of problems.

    There's a hilarious tidbit about something like this happening in Final Fantasy XIV 1.0 (the version before they blew up the world and rereleased the game):

  3. #3

    Tholren

    Contributor6 Posts

    I really don't think that a big amount of ability effects is that harmful if there is a clear visual distinction between the various abilities, and whether or not it is easy to identify abilities. Naturally, they should always keep in mind a certain philosophy to reduce unnecessary clutter. More importantly, however, is whether or not they call pull it off with the UE4, although @Atropos has approached that topic. 

    I wonder just how much communication and cooperation they have going on with Epic Games.

    @Nybling Did you know the engine SE used could only display a max of 40 characters on screen? That game was a real mess.

  4. #4

    Isarii

    Moderator80 Posts
    Tholren wrote on Feb. 14, 2018

    I really don't think that a big amount of ability effects is that harmful if there is a clear visual distinction between the various abilities, and whether or not it is easy to identify abilities.

     Go play a few Eastern MMOs. FFXIV is a great game, but man, its combat effects make me want to die. I feel like there's a legitimate seizure risk from the amount of particle effects being thrown around and I reeaally hope Ashes of Creation doesn't go that route.

  5. #5

    Nybling

    Contributor19 Posts
    Isarii wrote on Feb. 15, 2018
    Tholren wrote on Feb. 14, 2018

    I really don't think that a big amount of ability effects is that harmful if there is a clear visual distinction between the various abilities, and whether or not it is easy to identify abilities.

     Go play a few Eastern MMOs. FFXIV is a great game, but man, its combat effects make me want to die. I feel like there's a legitimate seizure risk from the amount of particle effects being thrown around and I reeaally hope Ashes of Creation doesn't go that route.

     When I cast magic spells, I want everything to be like

  6. #6

    Tholren

    Contributor6 Posts
    Isarii wrote on Feb. 15, 2018
    Tholren wrote on Feb. 14, 2018

    I really don't think that a big amount of ability effects is that harmful if there is a clear visual distinction between the various abilities, and whether or not it is easy to identify abilities.

     Go play a few Eastern MMOs. FFXIV is a great game, but man, its combat effects make me want to die. I feel like there's a legitimate seizure risk from the amount of particle effects being thrown around and I reeaally hope Ashes of Creation doesn't go that route. 

    I have played a bit of FFXIV in the past and I agree it can get a bit crazy, I also don't want AoC raids/PvP to look like this. I'm sure Intrepid will find that tasteful sweet spot between flashy and impactful and unnecessary visual clutter.

  7. #7

    Relic

    Member13 Posts

    Cant argue with anyone's observations or fears. Squeaky bum time until they get more game-work under their belt. Fills me with trepidation and excitement.

    Combat mechanics and carefully thought out class animations and skill gestures is going to take a long time to brainstorm. Especially a ground breaking system that cant afford to be anything but flawless in the current player climate.

    I do wonder if the players and intrepid really foresee the task ahead. This wont be a cakewalk if players hate some Intrepid ideas like the skill shot system. And mental block in a design realm will cause long delays that cant be accounted for. If the mechanics have not been deisgned at least in a overall framework sense already, then I will cringe. To be honest I wouldn't even consider making an MMO until all the combat mechanics and game mechanics were established in a fully realised system.

    Building a world is relatively straight forward if time consuming once themes are established. Game systems are another matter...especially inter related ones. And we havent even cosidered the lore/quest/storyline yet.

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